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Chapter XI
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Albatros
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Joined: 15 Jul 2005
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2006 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wal wrote:
How does a huge flying creature, with a bull on it's back, manage to get a higher terminal velocity than a chunk of meat? Some kind of snatching out of the water stunt, fine, but actually grabbing it out of the air? No way.


The chunk of meat is just falling, buffeted about by winds, and it's not really that dense. Its terminal velocity is a lot lower than the active diving velocity of the hippogryph, who has gone into aerodynamic diving mode, complete with feathers twitching this way and that like a sailboat tacking upwind. Hawks can hit the ground at ninety miles an hour.

the wingspan and breast muscle mass required to get a horse-like thing the size of Tamilin off the ground is absolutely prohibitive to flying in the first place, so as long as we've got hippogryphs flying at all, much less with a tauren or two on his back, cut me some slack on his diving speed? Smile

p.s., welcome to the forum!
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Exodus



Joined: 26 Feb 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2006 4:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, since you're so keen on having this conversation, there must have been a windspeed at which point the piece of meat would have been buffeted enough so that Tam could've caught it. Anybody want to calculate that windspeed?
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Nikolaus



Joined: 28 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2006 5:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perguine Falcons can hit a target on the ground at over 200mph i think a giant hypogryph could prolly do less than that but with similar dynamics to a falcon(except the hooves and that) he could do about that prolly but a tauren would throw all kinds of variables into that situation
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Exodus



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PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2006 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yea, the addition of a 2nd pair of feet to the hippogryph messes up its aerodynamics and such a lot I'd bet, a cow on its back wouldn't help much at all.
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Ulkarr



Joined: 23 Jul 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2006 6:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good chapter.

Didn't horse's first druidic teacher have a crane as his flying form?
Also, about the bone dragons, i couldn't quite picture what you were describing, are they the same as WC3 or were you trying to create something a bit different?
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Wal



Joined: 04 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2006 9:33 am    Post subject: You can have all the slack you want, Albatros Reply with quote

It's a great read.

Peregrine falcons are small and less dense than a tumbling piece of ham or whatnot. A fat slob of a peregrine would weigh 3 lbs. The falcon is a better comparison to the chunk of meat than the hippogryph.

Time for magic, then. A super aerodynamic bubble shield, or the good old fashioned tractor beam, to slow the meat down?
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michellethemit



Joined: 10 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2006 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm thinking that since the meat is smaller, it takes a bit longer than the two characters to hit the max speed (or w/e the term is) due to momentum. or something. My physics sucks.

Thing is, Tamilin is actually TRYING to fall. The meat isn't. Kinda like just cruising down a hill with no brakes vs going OMG PEDAL OMG PEDAL FASTER.
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Nikolaus



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PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2006 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the term is terminal velocity(6.some thing meyers per second i believe) and i agree
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Wal



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PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 4:35 pm    Post subject: Falling physics Reply with quote

A few basics:

1) In a vacuum, everything falls at the same rate, from a feather, to a hippogryph. Period, end of story. If the feather is dropped from the same height first, it will hit the bottom first.

2) Trying to fall faster is useless, as is the bike analogy (no offense meant). When you are on a bike, pedalling down hill, you are adding a force vector to gravity by pushing against the earth. When flying/falling, the only thing you would have to push against is the air. For the answer as to wether or not pushing against the air would make you faster or slower, get a documentary on birds of prey and see what they do.

3) Finally, consider the success rate of skydivers trying to save their buddies when they immediately have problems, like unconciousness by banging their heads on something like a planes tail on their way out the door. Basically, a tumbling human is followed by a "trying to fall faster" human. So far, the number of sucesses is 1, with both skydivers ending up in the hospital.

And, he didn't make any witty comments before chasing his buddy. Nor did he have a bull on his back messing with his aerodynamics.
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Alec



Joined: 27 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I say we just forget this topic entirely, and pretend it never happened.
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Exodus



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PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 10:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, first off, they're not in a vacuum, and the trying to fall thing is more complex than you seem to think. What he means is, Tam was trying to make himself as aerodynamic as possible, thus getting less wind resistance, while the meat wasn't trying to do anything because it's meat, and thus it had a potential for more wind resistance.

Horse on Tam's back screws it all up, but without horse on his back, Tam could easily catch the meat from out of the air. Not all birds can dive at the same speed, that's why the peregrin falcon is the fastest, because there're birds that are slower.
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Saranus



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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 1:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

And who knows whether there was wind buffeting the piece of meat around, slowing it down.
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Exodus



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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 1:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As I stated earier. Possible, but the math would be very insanely complex to do. Lets just say, he did it. Damn he's good.
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Nikolaus



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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 9:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I say that there are too many variables and the fact of magic in existence, atmopsheric conditions and tauren aerodynamics make the math almost impossible so lets just drop it like Alec said



Unless you are just using the meat falling thing to waste time while waiting for an update
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Wal



Joined: 04 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not really wasting time until an update, but had some high hopes for an interesting discussion, what with all the time that was spent on the whole moons topic. Keeping it up because I get the distinct impression most people have no idea how hard this really is.

But in the interest of wasting time until an update, here is a vaguely related demonstration of how difficult this would be. Get a friend with a dollar bill. Sometimes difficult to find, but you can do it. Fold the bill lengthwise in half. Have your friend hold the dollar bill, and place your thumb and forefinger at the bottom of the bill, to catch it with pinching action as it falls between your fingers. Then you have to convince the friend to let go of the dollar.

Unless you truly have the reaction time of a race car driver, or are anticipating the drop, the dollar will fall cleanly through your fingers. Point being, gravity accelerates things faster than you think.

Btw, loved the idea of feathers tacking, Albatros. Hilarious!
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